Tuesday, August 01, 2006

Momma Said...

Those in the business of talking sports like to put everything in an immediate historical context...before the ink is dry on the transaction. Best ever? Worst ever? Ugliest? Most overrated? Least talkative?

I'm not going to fall into that trap, because I'm not going to proclaim this the worst Met transaction ever...not by a long shot. Heck, this isn't even the worst transaction on a deadline day by a longshot. I will however, challenge anyone to give me a more bizarre 24 hours in Met history, which ended with a formerly undefeated Mets GM resorting to a pure panic move.

"And this is how one simple, formerly unspeakable act can move mountains." -Metstradamus, regarding an Andruw Jones dropped fly ball.
First off, I hope that one of you out there is taking the minutes for this...the first ever meeting of Met fans Against Drunk Drivers. We forget that sometimes, real life gets in the way of the dream world of sports. With one sober reminder of how the real world can work, a pitcher enjoying the best season of his young career can no longer perform as a key cog for a World Series contender gets his shoulder separated. Some jagoff in Miami has a few too many Flaming Alonzos, gets behind the wheel of a car, and unknowingly sets off a chain of events that would change the course of Mets history.

"When they break ground for the new stadium the construction gang will unearth and disturb some ancient Indian burial ground for unlucky and cursed members of the Iroquois nation." -Metmaster
When the day began, Omar Minaya was "swinging for the fences". We heard Jason Schmidt. We heard Roy Oswalt. And swirling in the middle of all of this was Lastings Milledge. We were intrigued. We were excited. Then we were confused.

When the day ended, not only was Milledge not traded, but he's at least a part time starter as Xavier Nady stunningly...inexplicably...is a Pittsburgh Pirate.

I understand the need to have a strong bullpen. Trading for Filthy Sanchez and acquiring guys like Chad Bradford and the since departed Jorge Julio at the start of the season, and at the slight expense of the starting rotation was the right move. But even with the Sanchez injury, there was enough in the bullpen between Aaron Heilman (who I would have put even money on having pitched his last inning as a Met on Sunday) that Omar Minaya didn't have to trade his starting right fielder to get a forty year old reliever, and a project. A simplistic rule of thumb when it comes to trades is that the team that receives the best player wins the trade. Xavier Nady is easily the best player in that trade. Roberto Hernandez is forty, and Oliver Perez, once a budding star, is a prospect turned suspect. That the Pittsburgh Pirates, one of only oh, I don't know, two teams in major league baseball that have no shot at the playoffs, got the better of the first place Mets in this deal is inexcusable. And what kills me is hearing about so many front running teams like the Tigers (Sean Casey), and the Yankees (Bobby Abreu) bringing in good to great players at a cheap price, while the Mets have to fill holes at the expense of a starting player.

Oh, and let me get this straight...six games back of the wild card? Jason Bay and Scott Kazmir get traded for veterans. Fourteen games ahead? Xavier Nady gets traded for someone who might be all right in the future? Who does this? Can this franchise be more backwards? Who trades a starting outfielder for an old reliever and a freaking project when you have an inside chance at the World Series? And this comes from the general manager who once traded Grady Sizemore and Cliff Lee for less than a month of Bartolo Colon? Does this make sense to you? Because I don't get it.

"It's like I don't even know who you are anymore." -Metstradamus, directed towards Omar Minaya
But it wouldn't be a Met deadline day if there wasn't some form of the supernatural involved. And that came when multiple reports had the Mets flipping Perez and Heath Bell to San Diego for a Filthy-like wonder Scott Linebrink. If this had happened, it would have been Nady and Bell for Linebrink and Hernandez, which while still unnecessary, I could have dealt with a little better.

Now deals that are reported as done are usually done, right? Well, according to media outlets (plural), it was done. Done! Except for one thing: it wasn't!!! And the reason it wasn't done was because the Padres understood rule number one about trades: "They who receive the best player wins the deal", and wisely backed out.

If Omar Minaya's grand plan all along was to get Linebrink, then why was the first deal done without being contingent on the second deal getting done? Does that make sense to you? Because once again, I don't get it.

So here's my scorecard on this deal:
  • The lineup? Worse today than yesterday with Chavez and Milledge platooning instead of Nady.
  • The bench? Again, worse today than yesterday, with Chavez moving to the starting rotation.
  • The bullpen? Worse today than yesterday. Although Omar Minaya wasn't the one driving the car that separated Filthy's shoulder, he didn't make the bullpen significantly better at the expense of their starting lineup and their bench.
  • And for Roberto Hernandez? Last season there were no expectations, being picked up from the scrap heap. This season, he was acquired for a starting right fielder. Hernandez is no longer the feel good story of the summer. There are now expectations involved...and we know how expectations go around here.
Does your scorecard match mine?

I know, I know, I probably shouldn't be overreacting. David Wright is still a Met. Jose Reyes is still a Met. The Carlos twins are still Mets. It should probably be enough offense.

But Omar Minaya panicked. He panicked because a drunk driver separated Filthy Sanchez's shoulder. He panicked because he employs the only millionaires in America who insist on riding in taxis.

"It's the second time in two years a Mets pitcher has been injured in a taxi. Tom Glavine lost two front teeth in an August 2004 accident while going from LaGuardia Airport to nearby Shea Stadium in a cab." -Associated Press
This whole deadline day just defies logic. Just as Andruw Jones dropping a fly ball at Turner Field defied logic. But maybe it is, in fact, extremely logical. Maybe things were going too good. Maybe, the baseball lords needed to remind us all that even fourteen games ahead, that this is still the New York Mets we're talking about. And as long as there are New York Mets roaming...and attempting to inherit the earth, there will always, as momma said, be days like this.

37 comments:

Jaap said...

I don't disagree that this was a trade of desperation Metstra, indeed a bad trade. But on the bright side we get to see Milledge prove whether or not he is a player we should be unwilling to part with (what better chance to prove himself than the postseason?) and if Roberto Hernandez falters, Heilman might get his chance as set-up man and make us all happy we never traded him to begin with. I'm sad to see the X Man go but when you're dealing from a point of weakness and desperation, there aren't many good deals waiting to blossom.

Anonymous said...

YOU, my friend, are over-reacting and bitterly negative here. We lost a barely league average (yet super-hot, according to my female friends) RF for a project that could be brilliant and a HOLDS guy who can be a valuable piece.

I have no idea, but were you screaming about losing Jae Seo for Sanchez?

Just take a look at your own poll. Not the best trade, but necessary is where the people lie, and if not for the stupid drunk driver portion (I usually promote roadside executions for drunk driving) wasn't there it would be 80-20 easily in favor as a necessary evil.

Andrew said...

I'm usually in complete agreement with you, so I typically don't post comments, but I've been moved to in this instance -- I just can't understand how people are upset with this trade. Xavier Nady was our starting rightfielder, yes, but he was our rightfielder like Braden Looper was our closer last year -- sure, he had the title, but that doesn't make him a good player.

We're talking about a 27-year old lifetime bench player who hit .233/.328/.474 with runners on for the season. .203/.309/.362 with RISP. .128/.190/.205 with RISP and two outs. Those are atrocious numbers. Those are Joe McEwing with HR power numbers.

And for this guy, the Mets get a solid bullpen arm that can replace Duaner Sanchez and an extremely promising starting pitcher. Is he a project? Sure. But so was Randy Johnson when the Mariners got him. Same with the Twins and Johan Santana.

I just don't think Minaya panicked here. His hand was definitely forced by the Sanchez injury, but this trade isn't as bad as you're making it out to be. Especially if Lastings Milledge hits .350 from here on out.

;-)

Metstradamus said...

Jaap,

I agree on Milledge. Show us, Lastings.

As for dealing from weakness, I wonder if the Pirates even knew that Sanchez was out. I'm sure that Omar kept it a secret as long as possible. We'll keep our fingers crossed.

Anonymous,

I am bitterly negative. You are correct there my friend.

But no I was not screaming about losing Seo. You can look it up here:

http://metstradamus.blogspot.com/2006/01/low-risk-no-reward.html

and here...

http://metstradamus.blogspot.com/2006/03/nl-east-preview-your-new-york-mets.html

Yes, Perez has upside...but these are the types of deals you make when you're out of the race. Not headed for the Series. While I do concede a chance that Perez will get right and that Omar will look like a genius yet again, given the options, I wouldn't have made this deal. Not that my opinion matters, but that's why I have a blog...so I can shove my opinion down everyone's throat. ;)

But I give you bitter. I can't deny that with a straight face...only a bitter beer face.

Metstradamus said...

Andrew,

Those are certainly damning numbers on X.

My anger would probably be better served for the guy that hit the cab that Filthy was in.

It just gets my craw because I was under the impression that Hernandez could have been had for less than X and the problem would have been solved. Omar made a deal for Julio that looked suspect but John Maine tipped the deal in his favor. Perez might do the same...

I hope.

What a bizarre day.

Anonymous said...

I have so much to say on this topic so I am going to organize this as much as possible
This is what my scorecard looks like.

The first thing I have to say is that you need to look at the bright side of things.
1. The lineup? The same as yesterday a platoon of Endy and Milledge in rightfield is not only as good if not slightly better than Nady but also gives us rightfield defense that is astronomically better.
2. The bench is the exact same. Milledge takes Nady’s spot. So what if Chavez gets a few extra starts. They are still 2 separate people and when one is starting the other is coming off the bench. Absolutely no difference in my eye except for that Milledge or Endy can replace Floyd in late game situation where we are up to shore up the defense. I like that defensive outfield. Milledge, Endy, and Beltran. Absolutely Superb.
3. The bullpen? Like I said at the beginning, look at the bright side. We can’t help that Duaner got hurt so…. From post-injury/pretrade to post-trade we got a LOT better.
4. Minors? Worse. Yes we brought up Milledge so he is no longer in our minor league system, but I have to say. Who cares! Isn’t the point of a minor league system to help develop our players and then bring them up to the major leagues. Plus we just added Oliver Perez to the minors as a potential ace that is a YOUNG, LEFTY, POWER pitcher. This is our redemption for Kazmir! I would have been OK with giving him up for Linebrink but only because he is still a project and Linebrink would have been a better replacement for Sanchez.
5. I also like to look at the bright side for Roberto Hernandez. He played in New York last year so Rick Peterson is very familiar with him and it seems he can handle the New York pressure. Also he will be the set-up guy not the closer so he won’t really have much heat on him when it gets to crunch time. Plus he is a veteran, I think he can handle it.
6. Omar didn’t panic. He executed a well thought out plan of attack. How you say? Well we had just lost our very, very good set-up guy and we needed a replacement. So he…
a. suppressed the leak of Duaner Sanchez’s injury
i. If he didn’t he would have every other GM ask him for the world knowing that he just lost the second best arm in the major’s best bullpen
b. He looked at his roster and picked out his possible trading chips
i. Xavier Nady or Lastings Milledge but not both and pretty much any minor leaguer.
c. He sought out potential trades to fix the problem
i. He saw that he can either get an ace starting pitcher (Schmidt) and send Orlando Hernandez to the bullpen OR trade for another bullpen arm or two in order to keep the level of play of the bullpen at yesterday’s status quo
d. Make a choice on which way to go while looking at your team holistically.
i. If he trades for Schmidt he has to give up the future in Milledge. If he trades for the bullpen arm he trades the present in Xavier Nady. Omar then looked at the Mets. You know what Omar saw? He saw a damn good team with a very good chance to make it to the World Series and win it if he keeps yesterday’s status quo and gets another good reliever to replace Duaner Sanchez. With the addition our World Series chances for this year increase, but our chances for future years will decrease. You know what else he saw? He saw a team that is primed for an extended run at the Crown year after year, not a team that is ready to throw away its future for a last ditch effort to win it all this year. This is not this team’s last hurrah, we WILL be back year after year. That is why this trade is not only brilliantly fills a short term need in Milledge but also gives us the hopeful future in Oliver Perez.

I would also like talk about some points you made.

1. But even with the Sanchez injury, there was enough in the bullpen between Aaron Heilman (who I would have put even money on having pitched his last inning as a Met on Sunday) that Omar Minaya didn't have to trade his starting right fielder to get a forty year old reliever, and a project.

You are right there was still enough in the bullpen, but only to keep it at slightly above average. You forget that one of the main reasons we are as far up in the standings as we are now is because our major league BEST bullpen kept almost every single lead the offense gave us.
Granted Xavier Nady was our starting right fielder but he was average to slightly above average at the hitting part to below average to atrocious at the fielding part. Like it or not, there are a lot of Xavier Nady’s out there so we traded a dime a dozen outfielder for a more talented, more athletic, and quite frankly more exciting version in Lastings Milledge. We may not have upgraded the hitting part much but the defense sure is a huge step up.
What are you going to say next year when that project is 22-6 with a 2.50 ERA and 275 strikeouts? That’s right I’m looking at the bright side.

2. A simplistic rule of thumb when it comes to trades is that the team that receives the best player wins the trade.

Trade Scenario: Let’s trade David Wright, Jose Reyes, Lastings Milledge, Mike Pelfrey, Philip Humber, Fernando Martinez, and Carlos Gomez for Albert Pujols. It’s OK we got the best player in the deal. We win. Trades shouldn’t be judged like that. We had a special set of circumstances specific to our organization and we traded according to our needs. We had Lastings Milledge so Xavier Nady was expendable.

3. That the Pittsburgh Pirates, one of only oh, I don't know, two teams in major league baseball that have no shot at the playoffs, got the better of the first place Mets in this deal is inexcusable.
I think this was a very fair trade but that also has to do with the fact that I didn’t think that highly of Xavier Nady’s abilities and I do think highly of the abilities of Oliver Perez under the tutelage of Rick Peterson, Pedro Martinez, and Tom Glavine. Also even if Xavier Nady is better than my opinion of him it is not our fault that we had to give him up to get decent bullpen help. Blame the damn Reds for setting the price for bullpen help so high. That Kearns trade almost reaches the level of stupidity of the Kazmir trade.

4. And what kills me is hearing about so many front running teams like the Tigers (Sean Casey), and the Yankees (Bobby Abreu) bringing in good to great players at a cheap price, while the Mets have to fill holes at the expense of a starting player.

We needed pitching and we did what we had to to get it done. Sean Casey is an old .300 hitter with no power and he is owed money. He has little to no trade value. Chris Shelton was sucking it up, Sean Casey gives them a veteran presence. Philadelphia should have eaten part of Abreu’s contract and traded him for real prospects, so the Philly front office is just dumb. The Yankees are also dumb because they needed real pitching help not Bobby Abreu or Cory Lidle.

5. Oh, and let me get this straight...six games back of the wild card? Jason Bay and Scott Kazmir get traded for veterans. Fourteen games ahead? Xavier Nady gets traded for someone who might be all right in the future? Who does this? Can this franchise be more backwards?

You got me on this one. When you put it like the Mets just seem stupid.

6. And this comes from the general manager who once traded Grady Sizemore and Cliff Lee for less than a month of Bartolo Colon? Does this make sense to you? Because I don't get it.
That was a bit of a last ditch effort season for the Expos. Imagine if they hadn’t made that trade. They might be in second place in this division and pretty close to a wild-card lead.

I think I should have my own blog as well. Everytime I decide to write on message boards about the mets or my Texas Longhorns (just graduated with a Pre-med Biology degreefrom UT), I end up writing something long and thought out. lol

P.S. - I love reading your stuff, keep it up.

Listmaker said...

i was a little perplexed by this trade as well but i don't think it was that bad. but your point is a good one - trading a starting player for a project on a contending team seems a little backwards. linebrink has been one of the best setup guys in baseball the past few years and if he could have gotten linebrink in this deal, i would have been really excited about it for '06.

and colon was on that team for more than half of the season i think. it was floyd who was only on the team for 3 weeks or so. i also think that brandon phillips was part of the colon trade. and to be fair, minaya thought that the expos were going to be contracted the next year so why not go for it?

dmg said...

thank you for giving a strong analytical voice to my concerns about this last trading day.

i'm sure the reality will prove to lie somewhere between the negatives you lay out and the positives some of your posters suggest. (oliver perez as "redemption for the scott kazmir trade" and our "hopeful future"? i think not -- he could just as easily be a nothingburger who rarely sees the inside of the locker room at shea and in any case is not the reason for this deal. talk about a forced optimism from merry sunshine.)

this was a deal compelled under the stress of bad circumstances in the final hours of trading. i don't doubt that minaya made the best of a bad situation, but that doesn't mean it wasn't fueled at least in part by panic. you got it exactly right -- this is the starting right fielder who in reality gave the mets a decent plate presence in the lower third of the batting order for a set-up man who caught lightning in a bottle last year but even then the mets didn't think highly enough of to keep.

this is also a consequence of our conversion from a pitching model that stresses the starting rotation to one that relies more heavily on its bullpen. it wasn't a wrong move -- we're a lock for the division, fr gosh sakes! -- but it created the sense in-house that the situation was more bleak than it really was.

throw in the fact that i don't think milledge is (at least now) ready for the bigs -- his last 10 days in the show had the look and feel of someone who was completely overmatched in the field (remember fenway?) and at the plate -- and we gave too much for too little.

or is chemistry, both the clubhouse and on-the-field sort, so previously well-regarded this season, now to be marked down and disregarded during this scramble?

again, the circumstances were not of the mets' making. but the response was. and i don't think anyone can seriously argue that the mets are stronger than they were yesterday.

Anonymous said...

Is it really necessary that Mets fans piss and moan over any trade? It feels like because of a few awful trades we've made in the past (e.g. Ryan, Kazmir), every Mets fan I know equates change with loss. They grow a personal attachment to players not because they played hard or came through at an important moment, but because we know what we have with that player while the person we acquire might be far worse. Most Mets fans were complaining when we shipped Cameron for Nady to begin with, and now they're complaining because we've shipped Nady for a necessary piece for our bullpen and someone who has the potential to be an ace. So, to analyze the overall trade:
1) Good setup man acquired instead of a hole in our bullpen.
2) Young left handed pitcher who had a mid nineties fastball and two plus out pitches (until arm surgery) to roll the dice with.
3)Lastings and Endy in right over Nady. This gives us better defense, maybe better offense, more speed off of the bench, three centerfielders who can play any of the outfield positions, time to develop Lastings at the major league level without worrying about playoff implications (see 14 game lead in the division), and dozens of other benefits that we won't see until this plays itself out.
And to review, even after this move we have the best bullpen and offense of any national league contender. Instead of celebrating a move that might elevate the current play of the team while simultaneously building for the future, everyone will sit here and complain about how great Nady was despite the fact that we all probably cringed when he approached the plate with a chance to drive runners in and two outs. All I am saying is that sometimes change can be good, and we as Mets fans tend to forget that.

Anonymous said...

I don't think the trade was as bad as many are making it out to be. As a Nady fan I have to admit he was expendable. He had to be traded to fill an immediate need (its not like we traded one of our stars). Can anybody really argue that his departure and replacement with Chavez/Milledgeis a signficant downgrade? Would you be happier if Milledge was traded? It is not a trade that I woudl have liked to make but it doesn't kill the team. In the future, we may all be glad Lastings was never traded - only time will tell.

I am also upset by all the whining from some fans about the injury to Sanchez. I love him but injuries do happen and teams have to deal with it (ie. The Evil Empire has been doing well after losing two STARS). People complaining that players are riding in TAXIS are also driving me crazy - limos can get into accidents as well. Lets face it, Sancez is alive and we should all be happy about that.

Now, lets stop whining and root for our team. We may not be better after the trade deadline but I don't think we are all that much worse without Nady. Besides, I recall that most people were upset when we first obtained him for Cameron. Lets just see what happens as trades can't be properly evaluated in the short term (much less before even one game is played).

The Metmaster said...

In the classic orginal "Dracula", Bela Legosi utters this line: "for one who has lived just ONE life, you know much Doctor"
Well, that's how I feel about UT/ pre-med Anonymous. (next timne you see Vince Young, thank him for me. I'm a Notre Dame fan. Screw SC!)
Your thoughts have been a balm to the open, raw wound that I felt yesterday. You make many good comments. But you must forgive us older Met fans. I remember the Fregosi trade. I watched with tears in my eyes as Tom Terrific was sent packing. Does the name Juan Samuel ring a bell?
But I'll do as the doctor ordered and calm down. With three kids, a mortgage, tuition, two cars, and a cat to pay for, my blood pressure is high enough.

Ed in Westchester said...

Metstra - The news about Filthy was on several blogs early yesterday, including a Philly blog. I heard about in on Metsgeek. So it is possible teams knew what was going on.
I am not as opposed to the deal as you. I will miss Nady somewhat, but as others here have noted, defense is upgraded.

I leave you with this:

Had Omar done nothing, and Heilman faltered, we would have killed him.

Unser said...

I have a simple question to assess this trade - is Roberto Hernandez really THAT much of an upgrade over Heilman?, Bradford?, Maine (who could have gone to the bullpen)?, even Heath Bell?

I don't get it. Sorry Omar - I was with you on everything else you've done, but this one smacks of an overreaction.

MD and Anonymous (3:27 a.m.) are on the money. When you trade your starting rightfielder, you better get something more than a 41 year old reliever and a reclamation project. Keep in mind - Milledge might not be ready yet.

BTW, there's a story going around that San Diego's GM was shocked at the Mets-Bucs deal, and would have traded Linebrink to the Mets straight up for Nady.

Sean said...

Endy gets on base more than X, and can run. I probably wouldn't mind seeing him start in the 2-hole against righties, him and Reyes on the bases seems enough to give opposing pitchers nightmares. Yeah, he doesn't have the power, but he has only 9 fewer extra base hits than Nady in 60 fewer at-bats. Oh, and he has 8 outfield assists without making an error all year. I'll take it.

Hopefully Lastings will have the maturity to deal with a platoon situation; I'm excited about him, but don't want to see him starting every day. Also, though he had his painful moments, I'm still prepared to say he's a far better outfielder than Nady. His three outfield assists were pretty spectacular.

I mean, I like X as much as the next guy, but the truth is that aside from his 14 homeruns, he doesn't really do too much for our team. (And a resurgent Cliff should be able to fill that power void quite nicely.)

Omar did what he had to do, and got a serviceable replacement for Filthy. While Roberto hasn't been nearly as impressive this year (opponents are batting nearly 40 points higher than last year), he's still good *enough*, especially if Aaron can get his head out of his ass sometime soon.

And I really do think that the acquisition of Oliver Perez may wind up making Omar look like a genius down the line. This guy was the one of the hottest young pitchers in the game two years ago; his strikeout numbers were nuts. Maybe the Jacket can work some of his magic on the kid's delivery, get his stuff a little more consistent.

A decent setup man and a kid who could be an ace for a right fielder that couldn't really field and couldn't really hit in the clutch, I'll take my chances.

And God, I hope Filthy is OK.

The Metmaster said...

Xavier Nady. A good Frenchman. Now that's saying something! Au revoir X.

Shari said...

Hi Mestradamus- I posted almost the same thing-they could have easily given the Pirates Victor Diaz, Jose Offerman a bag of balls and maybe a bag of balls for Hernandez and Perez. The only thing I will say is that Hernandez with an 0-3 record and 2.93 ERA will do even better on a first place team than a last place team.

Anonymous said...

Unser.... Berto is a huge upgrade over Bell. I would argue that he is more versatile than Bradford and Feliciano, and Oliver is needed as the longman. Heilman will probably take over Dirty's work, and Berto will take over Heilman's role, or perhaps there will be more of an even split between the two.

Maine? Right now I think we need him in the rotation. Pelf has been ok, but he may need more refining in the minors.

So if we don't make a trade and Maine stays in the rotation, who do we turn to? Do you want to give Heath Bell a bigger role? I don't. Henry Owens? He showed flashes but he also showed he needs more time. Royce Ring? More of a Lefty specialist and still unproven at the big-league level. Lindstrom? Hasn't pitched in the majors yet and his numbers in the minors aren't spectacular.

So really, there were no reliable homegrown options for a valuable role.

Does it seem like we overpaid? Yes. However when you consider the hand we were dealt, as well as the possibility of adding Linebrink as well. It wasn't a bad move, especially with someone as talented as Milledge waiting in the wings to replace an outfield spot. If it turned out to be Linebrink and Berto for Nady, then that would have looked a lot better on paper as it would have improved our bullpen. Out of all of our everyday position players, who was the easiest to let go. I would say that it was easily X. I'm sure Omar tried to get a deal for a solid reliever done for less, but a deal probably wasn't out there so he had to deal a valuable piece in order to get that help. Thankfully it was a piece that looks replaceable NOW. You can't say that about anyone else on the major league roster (save for Floyd I suppose, but Floyd > Nady). We could have tried to deal a SP but right now the rotation is shakey, and it needs to flesh itself out a bit first before we can determine who is tradeable.

Also, if Perez gain return to form we got an absolute steal. Perhaps, in a twist of fate San Diego reneging on the trade was karma's way of returning the favor to us for Dirty's taxi incident. Perhaps its not.

I hope that Perez has hit rock bottom. If that is so, then the only way to go is up. Even if he never regains his dominant form, he can still be a valuable asset if he improves some. Whether that is for us, or for someone else via a trade.

Time will tell.

Anonymous said...

Remember when you were 8 and playing RF meant you sucked? C'mon dude...get a grip...things ain't that different in the Big Leagues! Hey, did you guys hear that New York Water Taxi is starting service to Shea on August 4th from BK and Manhattan? Check their site or Mets for details...but I'm never riding the 7 again!

Anonymous said...

Remember back in Little League when losing your RF'er was a good thing cause he was the fat kid who hogged all the snacks after the game?

Hey - you guys hear about that New York Water Taxi starts service to/from Shea on August 4th!?!? Never taking the 7 again!

Unser said...

Anon 11:28, your points are well taken (especially re: Maine). But I would counter with this: yesterday was really not the deadline - I'm sure there will be at least be 2 or 3 right-handed set up men available who will clear waivers. Wouldn't it have made sense, with a 13 game lead, to at least wait a month and see if Bell, Bradford and Heilman would have sufficed? If they didn't, I bet that Omar could have traded for someone decent (maybe even Bert) who would clear waivers.

Anonymous said...

What the....?!?! That Musing borders on deranged insanity.

We needed another arm in the 'pen. We got one of the top 2 or 3 that were definitely available, and one who we know won't melt down b/c he is coming to NYC. We did this while giving up a RF who is barely an average corner outfielder offensively, and is god-awful defensively.

Lastings and Endy are both much better in the field, and offsensively we give up some power for a better OBP and more speed.

There was no panic, this was a calculated move under extreme pressure considering the time line and change in circumstances.

Anonymous said...

Unser,

You do not pick up halfway decent relief pitching on waivers. To even suggest the possibility much less ask that the Mets rely on such a liklihood occurring is irresponsible.

Anonymous said...

The lineup? Worse today than yesterday with Chavez and Milledge platooning instead of Nady.

Better! Milledge WILL be the everyday RF no matter what Omar says right now. Nady couldn't field or hit in the clutch.

The bench? Again, worse today than yesterday, with Chavez moving to the starting rotation.

The same since Chaves is staying put.

The bullpen? Worse today than yesterday. Although Omar Minaya wasn't the one driving the car that separated Filthy's shoulder, he didn't make the bullpen significantly better at the expense of their starting lineup and their bench.
And for Roberto Hernandez? Last season there were no expectations, being picked up from the scrap heap. This season, he was acquired for a starting right fielder. Hernandez is no longer the feel good story of the summer. There are now expectations involved...and we know how expectations go around here.

Can't argue this one. But this is no one's fault but the idiot drunk driver's. We are still playoff bound. And as far as I am concerned, the pressure isn't on Bert, it's on heilman. Time to take your nuts out of your purse Aaron!

Shea Gadfly said...

I didn't read all of the comments but didn't everyone see X-man kicking balls all over the place on Sunday and not hitting with the bases loaded or with men on base for that matter. I'm sorry but I think he got himself traded by being mediocre (and that's putting it nicely). He had some good games so I'll remember him okay I guess but I'm glad to have Roberto back...He was a bright spot in last year's season. He had an ERA in 40+ innings this year that was under 3.00 which is about what Sanchez has done (not to compare them but it is similar). We have a wealth of outfielders and needed some more depth in the pen. I wouldn't call it panic when I think it was pretty much done before Sanchez ever got in that cab. I hope the filthy one comes back but we need someone until he does...what other reliable relievers are out there that you could have gotten for a starting (for not even a half of one season)mediocre left fielder. What team was going to give us anything for Nady? What team was going to give us something we needed? Were there other teams willing to trade us reliable set up men for a sloppy fielding albeit "nice guy" left fielder? I don't see what the argument is...

AROD is SLAPPY said...

The Yankees now added Abrue. He will get on Base now and help SLAPPY get more RBI's. Even though SLAPPY won the MVP last year he is getting booed now but that is because he has not had any SLAPS since that 2004 ALCS. He needs to get back to his game and make sure he SLAPS the first baseman's glove each time he tries to beat out an infield hit.

Only SLAPPY has the ability to make this brilliant SLAP Play. Without it, he is just another average ballplayer with blue lips.

Daedalus said...

Oh, don't feel too bad. At least you aren't a Reds fan. We got Rheal Cormier and Kyle Lohse (will that be Lohser soon?) when we desperately needed a real fifth starter. And this, of course, is after we gave away Austin Kearns for no reason.

Unser said...

To Anon 1:22,

I'm "irresponsible"?

We're blogging about the Mets here dude, not trying to resolve the Middle East crisis.

Anonymous said...

Unser,

Fine then, it doesn't make you irresponsible, but it does make you a moron.

Unser said...

A moron. Now that's more like it.

Anonymous said...

I have to agree with you, Metstra. Nady was the Mets' starting rightfielder, meaning that whatever his deficiencies, they had no one better. Though Sanchez' injury left a gap in the bullpen, it could have been filled at a lower cost than one of the Mets' starting players. Perhaps it could have been filled internally (Bell, Ring, Owens). If not, players of Hernandez' quality just aren't that hard to come by.

Further, Hernandez was a player that the Mets could have had this season, but they didn't feel he was worth his asking price. Then, he wasn't worth a few extra bucks, but now he's worth their starting rightfielder?

Now the Mets will play Milledge, which will probably bring his trade value down. Before, he might have been worth a Schmidt or a Zito, but once the other teams see that he was over-hyped, the Mets won't get nearly as much for him.

Besides, when it comes to Milledge, character is destiny, and it's basically immutable.

Perez is the sleeper who could make it all worth while, but the odds are strong that he has permanently lost his mojo. Think Wally Bunker or Mark Fydrich.

Shea Gadfly said...

Fatso Fransesca is now blogging under the title "anonymous". It has to be him as I have never seen anyone around here call someone a moron over a baseball opinion.

Unser rocks!

"We're blogging about the Mets here dude, not trying to resolve the Middle East crisis."

&

"A moron. Now that's more like it."

Metstradamus said...

You guys are outstanding.

To the anonymous from UT, great stuff. I mean, wow! That was more thought out than some of the actual book reports I've written.

Great stuff...all of you.

Metstradamus said...

"Trade Scenario: Let’s trade David Wright, Jose Reyes, Lastings Milledge, Mike Pelfrey, Philip Humber, Fernando Martinez, and Carlos Gomez for Albert Pujols. It’s OK we got the best player in the deal. We win. Trades shouldn’t be judged like that."

Granted. But just to refine my point on that: The spirit of that rule of thumb was actually to say that if a player is traded for two lesser players, one always beats two.

"When you put it like the Mets just seem stupid."

Not stupid, they just zig when they should zag sometimes.

Marlon Muñoz said...

WD40 and phlegm???


Okay...Someone tell Heilman that he will not start and to concentrate on gettting someone out, please!
This freaking guy has the stuff but I honestly think he gets lost in his own mind.

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